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Hi Peter! A quick response: I agree with you on much that you say with respect to optimistic/pessimistic concerns viz the CCN and its future. We have a mixed track record, certain strengths & weaknesses and we face a changing and competitive world. However, in relation to the issue of VDN costs for non-profits, if you are trying to hang the future of the CCN on this limb, I think you're barking up the wrong tree. ;- > 1) We have (or will have) 5-6 of these. There has not been a stampede for this service since we 'officially' started offering it (2 of these have been in existence for some time). My familiarity with these groups leads me to the belief that if we tried to up the cost for these to $400/annum at least 4 of these would certainly opt out or move out (sports group; student newspaper; research project & prof group). Finding $400 one-time was a big enough shtick for them let alone $400 per annum. The NDP caucus seems willing to go ahead which is great. I've had conversations with 3-4 of our other IPs since the spring inquiring about VDN's. They've all put a VDN on a distant back burner since they feel the _current_ (one time) price tag is still too steep for them. Aside from the fact that I believe the proposed price tier doesn't reflect the (primarily) one-time set up costs, in any immediately foreseeable future I can't envision VDN fees (of the kind proposed) from the non-profit IP sector forming any substantive revenue source for the CCN. Not from our IP base. I'd be delighted to be proven wrong on this projection, however, ... ;-> 2) I do see potential significant sources of revenue from: A) Small-Business IPs: there are many of these; as Richard has proposed we could readily target certain sectors (perhaps currently under-represented?); Many such IP's have a real cash-flow; and we can offer rates that are more than competitive. (Hence my query about defining/resolving rates for such. Is it still $500 per annum?) B) PPP service: users/IP's want this.. I think this service is highly marketable; C) How about CSuite? I recall our business plan/forecasts the projected we could make/build a substantial revenue for this in terms of technical support and development once there was a sufficiently large installed base of the technology. I think we have a real winner on our hands with this technology. Where are we in terms of moving this technology? D) How about finding sponsorships for CCN pages? We've discussed this option in the past but we haven't secured any. There are a many possible such pages on the CCN and implementing some sort of sponsor logo/credit in suitable places is a low-cost, low-tech potentially on-going source of revenue. E) Using our in-house expertise in other contexts. This spring's Health-Canada project, very expertly administered by David Murdoch, was great template on how the CCN could draw on our own technical and training resources to provide a valuable service; generate some profit; create some employment; and create products of value and benefit for the CCN community at large. I see this as having laid the groundwork for what could be other such projects that could be both revenue generators of the organization and benefit it in other ways as well. F) Partnerships with other players in the infromation technology sector. We've talked before about strategic alliances with others (Sympatico?) who would be very interested in the user and IP base that we have. G) Partnerships with sites for PATs, Urban CAPs, Volnet initiatives, etc. The list goes on -- undoubtedly beyond my knowledge of the possibilities. 3) I don't know if the user trend (from 5,200 --> 4,800) is real or if it indicates anything significant at this stage, however, we do know that we are in a highly competitive environment for users and I don't know (or have any easy answers) on how we can compete. Here's a small illustration: Friday I was at the SNS Celtic Electric concert. Sympatico personnel were there in force (probably 10+ people) handing out and collecting sweepstakes form (+ exhibits, etc.) . They had a draw after intermission and gave away $100 gift certificate plus 2 free SNS tickets. Trivial cost. In return they got a thousand names, with their addresses, EMail addresses, age brackets, demographics & some Internet info. You want to guess how they'll use this information? ;-> I constantly wonder how we can compete with such marketing initiatives paved by revenues that we can only dream of. Look at the Sympatico marketing/demonstration sites at places like City Center Atlantic. Beautifully designed, equipped with top-flight hardware, fully staffed by people trained to market Sympatico in a sophisticated fashion (go in and ask for an M-powered demonstration sometime ....). It beats me. I share your view of CCN by 2000 and would like to see movement on all the changes you propose. If I can underscore what I think is a key element (and of course this does have cost repercussions ;->) it is to have more technical and administrative staff positions/time. I think in some areas we've reached the limit of what we can reasonably expect of volunteers in terms or running, developing and administering what is a very diverse and complicated system. Moreover, there are a whole range of issues (administering/deciding/implementing/invoicing pricing tiers being one of them ;->) that would be ever so much more efficiently dealt with by a staff person (with input from the Board and appropriate consultation) then by a decentralized group of volunteers such as we all are. Just my $0.02. Cheers, Chris _._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._. Christopher Majka <aa051@chebucto.ns.ca> Editor-in-Chief: Chebucto Community Net - Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada URL = http://www.chebucto.ns.ca/Home.html "We have ... in this country ... far too many captive editors who cannot even be heard to rattle their chains." -- Carl E. Lindstrom _._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._._.
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