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This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_037E_01D15F51.EF31C0E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi David P. & All Feb 4, 2016 ` I don't know how much or in what era you have farmed but the = pre-herbicide days were very different.=20 A huge bank of weed seed and we were always two weeks too late, = largely because weed control took an enormous amount of time and effort. = Farming without herbicides now, on soils with a depleted seed bank is a = piece of cake compared to the 'good old days' of trying to find inch = high carrots in foot high pigweeds. Hobby farmers had no problem. They = could afford to fallow till until the seed bank was depleted.=20 Yt. DW. Kentville ----- Original Message -----=20 From: David Patriquin=20 To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca=20 Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 11:08 AM Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Public consultation re use of pesticide... GMO = crops and loss of weedy species The weeds close to the crop are only problematical if you dont start = with a clean seedbed and/or heavily fertilize the seedbed before = planting the crop, which favours the weeds. Start with a clean seedbed = and postpone fertilization, and ...OK it's a treadmill. You start using herbicides and then you breed crops = that are not competitive with weeds.. so yes those crops are very = difficult to control mechanically although it can be done. Mechanical = tillage can be very sophisticated. As well, we separate crops and = livestock so we dont want straw, so shorter cereals are OK. Separated = livestock and crops results in massive aquatic pollution-- we pay for = that indirectly. Real cost accounting would not rate GMO crops more cost = efficient today and their costs have gone up as more resistance = develops.=20 We have created an industrial production system that is part of our = social fabric... it's not easy to re-evaluate.. and pursue a new tack = but we need to start looking at it. Those gigantic fields of GMO maize, = soy and cannola may give us "cheaper food" but we are paying for it in = many other ways. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- From: "rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca" <rita.paul@ns.sympatico.ca> To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca=20 Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 9:35 AM Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Public consultation re use of pesticide... GMO = crops and loss of weedy species The reason Herbicides are so much better from a farmers point of view = David is that herbicides kill the weeds close to the planted crop.=20 The weeds in the middle of the rows are not very harmful and are easy=20 to control by cultivation.=20 However the weeds close to the plants cause the reduction in yields.=20 They rob moisture, nutrients sunlight and harbour insects but there=20 is no way a farmer can remove them by cultivation. short of the old = hand hoe.=20 In addition they make harvesting more difficult by not allowing the = crop=20 to dry out in the short days of fall.=20 Farmers tell me herbicides give the best return on investment of=20 all their inputs. But maybe we would like to pay more for food!=20 Enjoy the thaw=20 Paul=20 =20 On February 4, 2016 at 8:33 AM David Patriquin = <davidgpatriquin@yahoo.ca> wrote:=20 =20 =20 Incororating resistance to Roundup & now a couple of other = herbicides (because weeds also becoming resistant) in GMO crops has one = huge effect on wildlife that I don't see discussed much or at all: the = complete obliteration of weedy species over massive areas, not seen much = in NS but go to Que and Ont where field after large field of GMO = soybean, maize and cannola are grown, and they are virtually dead except = for the crops; even after the crops are taken off they remain free of = weedy species. Under traditional management, weeds were set back by = tillage to allow crop to get established, then a diversity of weedy = species grow up in the understory, flowering and providing food for = pollinators, seeds for wildlife.. and after the crop is taken off, = groundcover. No more so. The farmers like the GMO crops because of the = simplified management, but with selection of appropriate cultivars, some = mechanical management, reducing some types of tillage...weeds can be = controlled without eliminating them and our farm fields can be more = supportive of wildlife. =20 =20 Glyphosate is toxic to plants and bacteria, so has huge effects on = the microbiotia also..=20 =20 Agreed, Nick: " As naturalists, impacts on natural world are our = major responsibility."=20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- From: Nicholas Hill <fernhillns@gmail.com> To: "naturens@chebucto.ns.ca" <naturens@chebucto.ns.ca>=20 Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 7:32 AM Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Public consultation re use of pesticide = Atrazine in Canada: a re-evaluation David,=20 no confusion here. Listserve focus is on nature not human safety. = Atrazine article deals with human safety concerns not biodiversity.=20 If we want to take a stand on pesticides it would be for their = biodiversity implications of which there are tons. Roundup is an example = but there are many=20 showing impacts of other pesticides on native bees and other = pollinators.=20 Nick=20 =20 http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1890/04-1291/abstract=20 http://www.jstor.org/stable/40983228?seq=3D1#page_scan_tab_contents=20 =20 On Wed, Feb 3, 2016 at 9:02 PM, David & Alison Webster = <dwebster@glinx.com> wrote:=20 Hi Nick,=20 The item dealt with Atrazine not Roundup. Best not to confuse = matters. =20 Dave W =20 =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Nicholas Hill=20 To: naturens@chebucto.ns.ca=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2016 8:12 PM=20 Subject: Re: [NatureNS] Public consultation re use of pesticide = Atrazine in Canada: a re-evaluation=20 =20 Gyphosate (roundup) going under radar despite the lethal impacts = of amphibian larvae (ca 98% kill) from the surfactant used to get the = pesticide across the plant's cuticle.=20 Not supposed to be used near water courses but amphibians are in = swampy woods.=20 As naturalists, impac